View Poll Results: Favourite Heroine - choose wisely

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  • Tsukamoto Tenma

    33 32.67%
  • Tsukamoto Yakumo

    32 31.68%
  • Sawachika Eri

    36 35.64%
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  1. #11
    Swampstorm is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by rikem
    and here it's about heroine not the same thing of favorite character... well i think.
    Well, everything is relative. When you look at it, the majority of the plot focus throughout the story is on Eri, so she is the heroine. The amount of characters you include with that term depends on how broadly you choose to define it. There's nothing to say that you couldn't include Mikoto or Karen under that category, either.
    Last edited by Swampstorm; 04-04-2007 at 12:12 PM.

  2. #12
    Kolox is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    But majority of appearance would (I'm guessing) have Tenma, since even if plot was focused on Eri, Tenma was always playing some role.
    When we think about main heroine, we could also see her as "the one who has majority of appearances with main hero" and I think we can agree that Harima is a main hero.

  3. #13
    ultraness is offline Senior Member Respected Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox View Post
    But majority of appearance would (I'm guessing) have Tenma, since even if plot was focused on Eri, Tenma was always playing some role.
    Tenma's always playing some role, but Eri has been playing the main role in the plot of late.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox View Post
    When we think about main heroine, we could also see her as "the one who has majority of appearances with main hero" and I think we can agree that Harima is a main hero.
    I believe Eri is the one who has the majority of the appearances with Harima. Scenes of Harima thinking about being with Tenma don't count as scenes of Tenma being with Harima.
    Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you. - Friedrich Nietzsche

  4. #14
    Kolox is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    There were lots of scenes where Harima met up with Tenma - I would dare to say that even more than Eri and Harima's (since from the very beginning, we had only 3 scenes with Eri and at least 10 or more with Tenma).
    Of course, you could say that most of them didn't affect their pairing much - but she still got to appear and there were few major arcs for Tenma x Harima - like curry plate, her birthday (short, but important), staying at Tsukamoto family home, getting present for Karasuma (equivalent to Harima's date with Eri in my opinion). Tenma gots a lot of plot time as individual and with Harima. But I don't say she is the only and true heroine of SR. Since Eri had great role lately and Yakumo, although she appeared less often - every her meeting with Harima was meaningful - thus I consider them as heroine too.

    SR is not like Love Hina or other of this kind manga - we didn't knew from the beginning with whom the main hero will end up. It's not so easy to decide on the only "heroine" of manga.

  5. #15
    Swampstorm is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox
    But majority of appearance would (I'm guessing) have Tenma, since even if plot was focused on Eri, Tenma was always playing some role.
    I'd actually classify Tenma as the "fifth business", in that she's important to the story structure, but not it's function. Her existence is necessary as the starting point for the story, but that's not the same as a functional role. I'd agree that Tenma is arguably the most important character in the story setup, but that isn't the same thing as being the main heroine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox
    When we think about main heroine, we could also see her as "the one who has majority of appearances with main hero" and I think we can agree that Harima is a main hero.
    While Tenma is significant from Harima's viewpoint, it's from the standpoint of a symbol rather than a character. Harima doesn't ever really see the real Tenma - he only sees the Tenma that he has created in his fantasies.

    Harima has created a vision for himself, toward which he is striving. Tenma's involvement is incidental - he hasn't worked towards building a relationship with her so much as he's tried to reach an end goal in which she is coincidently involved. To give up on Tenma would mean to give up that vision, and to lose that sense of direction. In that sense, he's forced to be committed to Tenma - to quit now would be to admit "defeat". But love is never about winning or losing.

    From the looks of things, the reason why Eri is such a problem for Harima is because she raises that doubt. The two get along very naturally - but they're not supposed to! It's awfully dangerous to get closer to someone other than the person you envision yourself in love with, after all.

    By the way, Eri took the spotlight right around the time when SR dropped the gag manga routine and started to organize itself into story arcs - around Ch.30 or so. She's been the dominant force in the plot since then - almost every story arc's conflict, with the exception of the basketball arc, has been centered around her.

    One of the hallmarks of a protagonist is their level of character development relative to other characters. I don't think Tenma has changed all that much from the start.

    Also, if you want to try another angle, there's an Tenma/Eri comparison in Ch.184/185 which evaluates their characters in parallel. Given that Mangoku is an outsider and has no prior character development, it's pretty safe to say that those chapters are a commentary of the author himself (even more so given the ending of Ch.185).
    Last edited by Swampstorm; 04-04-2007 at 01:11 PM.

  6. #16
    Kolox is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    You did not convince me about choosing only "one" heroine. I agree, Tenma and Eri has different characters and different way of involving themselves into the plot - but again - they do involve themselves into the plot. Yakumo too, although she could be called a "periodic heroine" - since her influence was great, but only for the limited part of the manga.

    Tenma influence on the plot never ceased to exist and even if she isn't the "aware" heroine, every her actions decides upon plot development. It's seems Harima is just following lines which Tenma created and Eri is just following Harima.

    If we think about it - Eri could be also called a periodic heroine. True, she appeared in the beginning of man and had several situations significant to plot, but so did Yakumo. Then Yakumo got her "plot development" and with time - it ended. Then Eri snatched it, then again Yakumo and then again Eri (for some longer time). Now Eri dropped it again. But in Tenma situation - Tenma was always there, whatever Eri was dominant or Yakumo was.

    Still, I stand firmly that all 3 girls should be considered as main heroines of SR - since most plot takes place around them.

  7. #17
    Swampstorm is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Well, before we go any further, you'd need to explain specifically what you mean by "heroine". A character can be important or influential without being a protagonist. Usually some of the key features that are present in protagonists include:
    1) Character Depth
    2) Character Development

    While certain characters may become significant for various subplots, the term protagonist applies more generally to the story as a whole. Questions that are worth asking include:
    -Which character has shown the greatest amount of growth and change throughout the story as a whole?
    -Which character experienced the major conflicts and difficulties throughout the story?

    In romance manga, the author may choose to play around with a number of relationship possibilities throughout the story. If you watch carefully as the story progresses, you can see key moments in the story where a character or pairing is irreversibly moved to the forefront. It is really easy to point those moments out in hindsight, once a manga has been completed, but the more you see this sort of plot trick, the easier it becomes to recognize even in a series in progress.

    I just finished reading Fruit Basket, so I can point that out as a fairly strong example. If you just watch the anime, or if you read only the first part of the manga, you might tend to make certain assumptions as to who the main male protagonist is, or what the main pairing is. Even though some characters are influential and important for a larger portion of the plot, if you keep an eye out for those "key moments", you can see clearly who the author flags down as the primary protagonist, well before it becomes blatantly obvious at the end of the series. In Fruit Basket, Ch. 68 and Ch.85 are pretty good examples of those key moments.

    Coming back to School Rumble, you can see moments like this as well. The most recent one was Ch.115-116, with Yakumo's realization regarding Eri. As long as KJ kept Yakumo's situation with Harima ambiguous, there was room to experiment with the pairing, if he wished to do so. Ch.116 is a key moment because it locks the storyline. It would have been fairly simple to make the scene reversible - just by having Yakumo say that she wished that she could have a relationship with Harima, or even by simply saying that she doesn't feel good enough for Harima (a situation that we've seen with Eri several times in the manga, every time she feels outdone by a rival). When Yakumo instead says that a relationship between herself and Harima won't work because Eri is meant for Harima, she locks down the storyline and gives the audience a cue as to the direction of the story. There's no method of undoing this sort of statement without making the story inconsistent. Compare this chapter to my FB examples if you want - they're remarkably similar.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox
    Tenma influence on the plot never ceased to exist and even if she isn't the "aware" heroine, every her actions decides upon plot development. It's seems Harima is just following lines which Tenma created and Eri is just following Harima.
    Tenma may create conflicts, but she doesn't really experience them - unless you mean to suggest that the conflict between Tenma and Karasuma is the most visible conflict throughout the story.

    It doesn't matter who creates the initial problem - what matters is who experiences it, and how they change and grow as a result of it. You could replace Tenma with any other girl (so long as she was unaware of Harima's feelings), and Eri's situation with Harima would still be the same. If you replace Eri with another girl, however, the way in which that girl responds to the conflict created by Harima's crush would be different based on her individual personality - so the story changes.

    It's not about Eri, Tenma, or Yakumo being more "important". It's about which character is used to explore the main conflicts in the plot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox
    If we think about it - Eri could be also called a periodic heroine. True, she appeared in the beginning of man and had several situations significant to plot, but so did Yakumo. Then Yakumo got her "plot development" and with time - it ended. Then Eri snatched it, then again Yakumo and then again Eri (for some longer time). Now Eri dropped it again. But in Tenma situation - Tenma was always there, whatever Eri was dominant or Yakumo was.
    Refer to my FB example. Simply "being there" has little to do with being a protagonist. Novels sometimes use a third person narrator - someone who is "always there", more so than anyone else. Does that make them the protagonist?

    In some cases, dropping out of focus brings you more into focus. Since we never saw the aftermath of Ch.117, everyone is all the more curious about what the situation is between Harima and Eri - even though we're currently seeing plenty of scenes involving Tenma and the minor characters.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kolox
    Still, I stand firmly that all 3 girls should be considered as main heroines of SR - since most plot takes place around them.
    All of the plot takes place around the entire cast of SR. Does that mean that the entire cast are all main protagonists?

    Standing firmly doesn't make you correct.
    Last edited by Swampstorm; 04-05-2007 at 07:43 AM.

  8. #18
    liekiamhiung is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    Errr, fellow friend. i do believe this is a thread for VOTING PURPOSE ???
    Not a thread to discuss who is the heroine of SR ( personally i think it will be a waste of time trying to discuss this regarding so many POV swirling in the air )
    Make another thread discussing that topic

    I like Tenma since the start so my vote goes to him.....

    EDIT : Just read the thread title. Favorite Heroine with the poll on Eri, Yakumo, Tenma. The three of them are considered heroine by many right ? so i don't think there is anything wrong with that IMHO...
    Last edited by liekiamhiung; 04-05-2007 at 06:56 PM.
    LONG LIVE HIME-SAMA. MY LIFE FOR RUMBLANDIA!


  9. #19
    _Vincent_ is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    The Three of them are the most popular Harima pairing Faction and we all know that Harima is the main hero of the story. So any of those three can be the heroine of the story.

  10. #20
    Kolox the Pope is offline Banned Frequent Poster
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    I'm cheating Another vote for Tenma !! Tenma über alles !! Tenma zwyciężczyni !! - or simply saying, Tenma rules

 

 
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