Thread: Naruto Chp 520 Discussion/521 Predictions

So how else do you think he could rebuild bodies exactly as they had been in life? Magic? Souls don't come with free bodies attached. He used the information in their DNA.

*facepalm* How are you not getting this? He didn't rebuild their bodies as the same, hence the use of a live sacrifice. Their attributes of the soul merely manifested on the new body, and apparently from prior use of ET a soul is the person's state of body & capability before dying.

On the bio, which one are you talking about (and link me if you can)?

On the opinion, you've once again superimposed me into your opponent. As I said before, I have no special opinion of superiority between the villages or Kabuto:

Meh, there's no strong case either way. We don't know what villages do with their corpses, and we don't know what inside information and jutsu Kabuto used to infiltrate the village and take DNA.

But historically speaking, you're just wrong on your intuition on the villages. The fact that an organization of exclusively S-rank ninja could be created, that so many kages and jinchuurikis have been assassinated in their own villages, that the villages don't change their barrier passwords despite accumulating S-rank traitors who will likely attack the village later all show the weakness of a ninja village to powerful or especially stealthy ninja.

So often you bitch about how Kishi's invented a plothole or hack because he hasn't built a situation that conforms to your intuitions, but to most of us this is just your reluctance to fix your bad intuitions. Before Kabuto's admission of extensive gravedigging, we couldn't say whether Kabuto could go graverobbing across the continent due to the lack of information I mentioned, but now Kishi's given us the answer in the opposite direction of your intuition.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

I see, it's no use.

Indeed. No point in pointing it out again and again if you refuse to acknowledge it.

Originally Posted by Urameshi-sama

*facepalm* How are you not getting this? He didn't rebuild their bodies as the same, hence the use of a live sacrifice. Their attributes of the soul merely manifested on the new body, and apparently from prior use of ET a soul is the person's state of body & capability before dying.

They look the same, have the same elemental affinities and bloodline limits, and use all the same jutsus. The only logical source for the replication is their DNA. Kabuto didn't miraculously memorise the exact physical facial and body structure for all the shinobis.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

On the bio, which one are you talking about (and link me if you can)?

The one on the Naruto wikia. And before you say it's unreliable, there are people monitoring those articles that ensure nothing is edited in that isn't accurate. I know from experience.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

On the opinion, you've once again superimposed me into your opponent. As I said before, I have no special opinion of superiority between the villages or Kabuto:

You can call me your opponent if you like. I'd argue the same for any disagreement I wanted to state.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

But historically speaking, you're just wrong on your intuition on the villages. The fact that an organization of exclusively S-rank ninja could be created, that so many kages and jinchuurikis have been assassinated in their own villages, that the villages don't change their barrier passwords despite accumulating S-rank traitors who will likely attack the village later all show the weakness of a ninja village to powerful or especially stealthy ninja.

I don't see how that changes what I said. When the Akatsuki came to get Gaara and Naruto they had to resort to a full-scale frontal assault. They didn't sneak in and spirit away the jinchuuriki with everyone scratching their heads about it.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

So often you bitch about how Kishi's invented a plothole or hack because he hasn't built a situation that conforms to your intuitions, but to most of us this is just your reluctance to fix your bad intuitions. Before Kabuto's admission of extensive gravedigging, we couldn't say whether Kabuto could go graverobbing across the continent due to the lack of information I mentioned, but now Kishi's given us the answer in the opposite direction of your intuition.

He's given no concrete answers, just a vague hint. That's why we're having this argument in the first place. Until Kishimoto gives a proper explanation as to how Kabuto got all these DNA samples, I'll continue to maintain, with good reason, that simply robbing graves in every village without getting detective is implausible.

Indeed. No point in pointing it out again and again if you refuse to acknowledge it.

Say what ?

Man, You're the one telling me that ?

I'm not the one not hearing any argument there... You're just stuck to your own point and keep repeting them.
You don't have to change your mind since there is no real proof, only hints about what we say.

But damn, man, you really need to be more humble about yourself. Just take into account that you might be wrong.

What you say is not canon just because you say it. Urameshi is really right, about your reluctance to fix your bad intuitions.

He's given no concrete answers, just a vague hint. That's why we're having this argument in the first place. Until Kishimoto gives a proper explanation as to how Kabuto got all these DNA samples, I'll continue to maintain, with good reason, that simply robbing graves in every village without getting detective is implausible.

And if he does gave an explanation, you'll call a plothole. Because it won't go the way you think it should.

I don't see how that changes what I said. When the Akatsuki came to get Gaara and Naruto they had to resort to a full-scale frontal assault. They didn't sneak in and spirit away the jinchuuriki with everyone scratching their heads about it.

Why would they do that ? Tring to sneak and imprison a Jinchuu ? Gaara at that ? Oh wait, they tried ! Attacking by the sky! Sasori even used his spy ! But.. It failed...
Plan B, draining him out of chakra while fighting and using the village as an hostage, is by far, better. And not to say, it worked.
That and, abducting a kage in his village, and robbing grave, is not on the same scale. Really, really not.

The one on the Naruto wikia. And before you say it's unreliable, there are people monitoring those articles that ensure nothing is edited in that isn't accurate. I know from experience.

I don't think he was talking about an Internet bio (which can, you know, easily be updated). Maybe about the official books one.

They look the same, have the same elemental affinities and bloodline limits, and use all the same jutsus. The only logical source for the replication is their DNA. Kabuto didn't miraculously memorise the exact physical facial and body structure for all the shinobis.

He don't need to memorize, he just summon the soul/chakra. He's NOT the one modeling the body...
That and, I don't know, I'm not a scientist, but are you sure that the composition of your dna change during your life ?? I don't really think so ... I think you have it since the start. I don't think your dna change because your hair go white ...
But well.

Originally Posted by The Witcher

I don't see how that changes what I said. When the Akatsuki came to get Gaara and Naruto they had to resort to a full-scale frontal assault. They didn't sneak in and spirit away the jinchuuriki with everyone scratching their heads about it.

To be fair there is a difference from sneaking into a village and capturing a Bijuu vs Kabuto sneaking into a village for a sample of someone's DNA (and I do mean sample because Kabuto mentioned to Madara that he doesn't need an entire corpse just enough. He even boasted that he would be able to create and ET Jiraiya with some of his leftover blood from Pain's weapons and another Shinsui with some of the DNA he had leftover in Danzou). Konan mentioned that they could sneak inside of Konoha undected but at that pain simply told her to stfu cause he had his own way of doing things. When the mission is to capture a Bijuu chances are there will be a fight so people will get alerted but for Kabuto's sole mission of getting some DNA wouldn't draw much attention because he isn't going there to fight.

In other words getting into a village undetected is not hard for top class Akatsuki class ninja. Thats all I really wanted to say on the matter of Village security.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

Say what ?

Man, You're the one telling me that ?

I'm not the one not hearing any argument there... You're just stuck to your own point and keep repeting them.
You don't have to change your mind since there is no real proof, only hints about what we say.

But damn, man, you really need to be more humble about yourself. Just take into account that you might be wrong.

What you say is not canon just because you say it. Urameshi is really right, about your reluctance to fix your bad intuitions.

I explain why your points are implausible/unfeasible and you merely refute them and restate the same. Who's the one being repetitive here?

I believe in things that are logical and plausible within reason. The depths of ineptitude you're prescribing for all five ninja villages and their inhabitants just to make Kabuto's actions look plausible aren't. Pride has nothing to do with it. Not for me at any rate.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

And if he does gave an explanation, you'll call a plothole. Because it won't go the way you think it should.

What great precognitive skill! He predicts my future thoughs and actions long before they ever happen. Ah, my pride is shattered!

Originally Posted by Jahnin

Why would they do that ? Tring to sneak and imprison a Jinchuu ? Gaara at that ? Oh wait, they tried ! Attacking by the sky! Sasori even used his spy ! But.. It failed...
Plan B, draining him out of chakra while fighting and using the village as an hostage, is by far, better. And not to say, it worked.
That and, abducting a kage in his village, and robbing grave, is not on the same scale. Really, really not.

That was my answer to those using the trapping of jinchuuriki as an example of why the villages wouldn't be able to stop the Akatsuki sneaking in. Don't twist it.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

I don't think he was talking about an Internet bio (which can, you know, easily be updated). Maybe about the official books one.

It's very annoying having to repeat myself, but you seem to keep glossing over half of everything I say. I know from experience that there are people monitoring the wikia articles who will edit back any changes that are found to be inaccurate to the canon and Kishimoto's writings. There has been no official databook released in years, so this is as up-to-date as we can get.

Originally Posted by Jahnin

He don't need to memorize, he just summon the soul/chakra. He's NOT the one modeling the body...

That and, I don't know, I'm not a scientist, but are you sure that the composition of your dna change during your life ?? I don't really think so ... I think you have it since the start. I don't think your dna change because your hair go white ...
But well.

You seem to have lost track of what we're arguing about here. I said that Nagato's resurrected self shouldn't have the Rinnegan if it had been an implanted organ. You disagreed. Your own answer here supports my point, because the Rinnegan wouldn't be in his DNA in the first place, nor should his soul somehow plant it in his body.

BTW souls don't carry elemental affinities and kekkei genkai: bodies(and their DNA) do.