Thread: The First Hokage and Madara

Hashirama and Madara are renowned as two of the most powerful Ninjas in the Naruto world.
However, dispite this great power, we still don't know a lot about them. The reason I created this Thread is to explore the various theories and speculations there are concerning these two ninja gods.

The first thing I noticed that convinced me to start this thread is a certain picture I saw in Naruto chapter 399 page 10 -11.

In the picture Hashirama has summoned 7 swords from a scroll he was wearing on his back. One of the swords looks kind of like the Beheading sword that Zabuza used. There are a lot of questions regarding how this would be possible, but wouldn't it be cool if he used the seven swords of the mist to fight Madara. I could just be looking into things too deeply but its fun to speculate. Hope you guys like the thread : )

Hashirama:

-Could control Bijuu, and said to have kept many as pets.
-Only person ever to use Wood element (besides from Yamato, who in all logic is his "clone baby.")
-Gained the body of Sage of the Six Paths.
-Married a Jinchuuriki, which apparently he put in her, since you know, he can control Bijuu (makes sense?)
-Ruled over the Senju Clan
-Netconned to be more powerful than he actually was (see fight with the 3rd).
-Had a less talented, but still very powerful little brother.
-Was some sort of Mentor to the Third.
-Distant cousins to the Uzumaki Clan.
-Had a fight with Kakuzu a long time ago and apparently won that fight.

Really, there isn't much more we need to know about Hashirama. His story is basically done; we don't need to know how he liked his toast or which brand of Konoha Ramen he liked.

Madara however, is a little more of a mystery since we don't know if the current Akatsuki Madara told the whole truth when he spoke to Sasuke.

I just wonder how Hashirama beat Madara. We know more about the first than Madara. However, there is still a lot about the too that is left unanswered. It would be cool if they made a movie of their fight. : )
Perhaps thats when Madara lost his eye.

No doubt the First was strong. But it's been stated that Sarutobi was stronger, and from all the retcons we've been seeing with the Second(Edo Tensei, space-time ninjutsu) it looks like he was stronger as well(well, not counting the Bijuu).

About madara i think theres more to it then it seems. Like i get the feeling that his little brother is involved when the nine tails attacked, and akatsuki.

I am mainly interested about what Madara Fears/Weaknesses. For someone strong enough to withstand Amataretsu and keep up with the yellow flash, there needs to be some drawback that we are not seeing. Only time I saw Madara freak out is when Kabuto showed him one of his coffins. I don't want to start another guess whos in the coffin, but it would be nice hear some feed back on madara's powers and drawbacks.

How much does anyone want to bet that the real reason why they fought was because they both were after the 1st's wife (forgot her name)? Seriously, the way kishimoto writes, it wouldn't be that hard to guess.

Originally Posted by TenchuNinjaGuy

I am mainly interested about what Madara Fears/Weaknesses. For someone strong enough to withstand Amataretsu and keep up with the yellow flash, there needs to be some drawback that we are not seeing. Only time I saw Madara freak out is when Kabuto showed him one of his coffins. I don't want to start another guess whos in the coffin, but it would be nice hear some feed back on madara's powers and drawbacks.

From what we know Madara´s (or anyones) EMS has no real drwback (exept massive chakra consumption) and of course his ability isin´t really an attack, so it only helps his mobility. But since the moment I saw the Kabuto/Madara secret-in-a-coffin situation all my alarm bells went off. Something tells me that the famous Tobi is not madara. Why do I think this? Well first of all he always wears a mask covering one eye...sort of makes your other Sharingan useless. Also he isin´t as immortal as he proclaims- He had the shit scared out of him when Danzo used his Kamikaze attack...and theres something about the whole Kabuto coffin incident that is very very fishy.

This is my own theory, but what if from the beginning, it was Madara's little brother who just killed Madara for his eyes, fooling even Harishama his "best" friend when they fought, etc... and created Akatsuki after that.
Kabuto would have only summoned Madara's body, since Tobi would only be in little brother Madara (should remember his name -__-)
Besides, Kabuto could probably only summon a body. Which body could reveal a part of Madara's secret?

Nothing to do with that, but Sasuke is the little brother as well.

My guess is that Obito broke. He didn't die when the rocks fell on him and spent x amount of days waiting for Kakashi, Rin, and Minato to dig him out. When they didn't he got pissed off. Somehow he crawls out of his hole where an aging Madara finds him. Madara uses the power in his possession (just a really good medic that he knows) to heal him completely, but since he doesn't have his second sharingan he uses his mask to cover the hole where his eye should be.

Tell me have we seen Madara use the MS? All I remember seeing is just the regular 3 tomoe sharingan.

Well anyways, Madara sees the resentment in Obito and starts training him to continue with his mission to destroy Konoha. So he teaches Obito everything he could, before Obito either kills him, or Madara dies of old age.

Sasuke doesn't know Obito from Madara so he's not a good source of information on the subject. And the last body in Kabuto's coffins was Madara's. Obito freaks out because now there is at least one person who knows that he's not really Madara and the mystique that comes from the name is lost.