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  1. #11
    x20a is offline Senior Member Frequent Poster
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    YESSSSSSSSSSS ITACHI!!!!

    Even if he's dead, the guy's still fucking bad ass; he's like the michael jackson of Naruto.
    Itachi > Death.

  2. #12
    The Witcher is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Merry Christmas. I'm guessing Kishit(my present to the mangaka: a well-deserved nickname) must be having a ball, having left his one and only son a new Christmas present.

    It's no secret I'm not at all happy with this manga's direction for the past month, but I'm not the only one. Everyone in every forum can see the blatant disparity in Kishit's treatment of Naruto and Sasuke ever since the Pain arc. While Naruto's been degraded non-stop by portraying him as a pushover, a beggar, a crybaby and an indecisive wimp all in rapid succession, his rival has once again taken centre stage, jumping from one Kage-level fight to another and generally acting like a badass.

    This has pretty much polarised the fanbase: Sasuke fans are pleased to no end and are gleefully pointing out how lame they think Naruto is while others are going into damage control trying to explain Kishit's writing. Ultimately, Naruto lies shafted and facefirst in the snow while Sasuke rises ever higher towards godhood with yet another divine upgrade.

    ....

    Going back to the chapter, Sasuke's new Hawk summon is a huge asspull considering he's been either fighting non-stop or recuperating from said fights ever since Itachi died; short of PNJ he couldn't possibly have had time to look for a summoning contract. Why, Kishi? What was the point? He could just have used Susanoo to break his fall like with the Raikage's powerbomb. It seems to me that Kishi's old decision to strip Sasuke of his snake techniques to balance him with Naruto has been eating him up ever since; out of guilt he's given him a new summon thinking it's the right thing to do; but in doing so he nullified one of Naruto's two remaining advantages! Now Sasuke will be able to nuke his enemies from the air like Deidara! And Naruto who has no ranged jutsu other than the inaccurate Rasenshuriken will need PNJ to beat him...
    Last edited by The Witcher; 12-24-2009 at 10:04 PM.
    I'M NO HERO, BELIEVE IT!

  3. #13
    ivanov_2020 is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    ^ i think the new summon eagle is one of itachi's jutsu... basically itachi just gave him everything he knows....

    my impression of danzo from this chapter:

    there is no danzo.... there is a hand full of eyes, but no danzo... the real danzo is the crippled... the one that control his body now is those eyes. no wonder he need kabuto, to take them off..

    my impression of sasuke from this chapter:

    he is being fu** by two elderly... i'm sorry, i mean he is being toyed by two elderly (somehow that doesn't change the meaning at all).... make that three if that is the real itachi, and all this time he fake his dead and hide inside sasuke so he can get to meet danzo...

    question:
    is the sharingan at the last page is a new MS, an unclean page, or EMS from itachi+sasuke MS?? it kind of look like one of those royal symbol that the japanese has now

  4. #14
    JZBaltazar is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Danzou does not look the kind to be so calm when losing lives one after another so I also think this one is just a fake.

    Eagle is too lame - where was he before if Sasuke never used him and why does not Madara know about it if he belongs (belonged) to Itachi? It does not look like an ultimate technique that you hide until the very last moment.

    That was my thought too that Sasuke is a sex toy of elderly men now - Orochi, Madara and Danzou (and Kishi too).

  5. #15
    Nicholas71 is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    Interesting fight, but...Danzo seems rather careless. Come on, I'm sure he doesn't have to rely on his weird kawarimi-ish jutsu to fight, especially since it seems to be using his Sharingans somehow. If the jutsu is limited, then it's rather stupid for him to get hit so easily.

    I don't like Sasuke pulling out a new summon just like that either, but the Itachi theory does make sense...we don't know exactly what Itachi transferred into Sasuke, other than MS jutsus. He could have easily put in some chakra as well, similar to Sasuke absorbing Orochimaru - hence the hawk and Itachi appearing at the end. I will say though, it's quite a Christmas present for Sasuke, whereas Naruto gets nothing this chapter.


    Merry Christmas. I'm guessing Kishit(my present to the mangaka: a well-deserved nickname) must be having a ball, having left his one and only son a new Christmas present.

    It's no secret I'm not at all happy with this manga's direction for the past month, but I'm not the only one. Everyone in every forum can see the blatant disparity in Kishit's treatment of Naruto and Sasuke ever since the Pain arc. While Naruto's been degraded non-stop by portraying him as a pushover, a beggar, a crybaby and an indecisive wimp all in rapid succession, his rival has once again taken centre stage, jumping from one Kage-level fight to another and generally acting like a badass.

    This has pretty much polarised the fanbase: Sasuke fans are pleased to no end and are gleefully pointing out how lame they think Naruto is while others are going into damage control trying to explain Kishit's writing. Ultimately, Naruto lies shafted and facefirst in the snow while Sasuke rises ever higher towards godhood with yet another divine upgrade.

    ....
    I disagree with your claim that everyone in every forum sees this supposed disparity...although I do agree that Sasuke gets a lot of screen-time and lots of high-level fights, I don't think that degrades Naruto. After all, Naruto being one of the good guys and there being not many bad guys left, he can't really have many Kage-level fights. Whereas Sasuke is being hunted by practically all the Kages. Maybe your measuring stick is just different, but I don't measure how much Kishi favours his characters by the techniques he gives them or the screen-time.

    But if you're talking about the coolness factor...then I get it. Sasuke's the dark dangerous guy with the flashy jutsus, whereas Naruto has recently been grovelling, punched and hyperventilating. But I also take into account the character development, of which Naruto has obviously been benefiting from. Sasuke, who was once cool AND likeable in a warm way back in Part 1, is now...still somewhat cool, but also less warm. I dunno about his fanbase, but I'm sure they can't have approved him leaving Suigetsu and Juugo behind, for one thing.

    Whereas Naruto...he's grown. Last time he would have demanded Raikage not hunt Sasuke, but this time he humbled himself and asked nicely. Didn't work, but it was the right thing to do. Raikage may have liked it more had Naruto shouted, but...he wouldn't have acceded. So no, Naruto has not been looking cool...but he's been earning my respect. I'm actually not anti-Sasuke though, I've liked Sasuke since way back, but he's just got that cool factor, it's always been that way. That's all he's got. Naruto is the kind who quietly earns your respect, if you take the time to see it.

  6. #16
    ivanov_2020 is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    ^ i agree bout the naruto-sasuke coolness thingy.

    but for danzo... when i say that danzo is not there, i don't mean that the danzo body that sasuke been killing is just a jutsu or it is just a fake. what i mean is that danzo doesn't exist at all. there's an arm full of eye exist, dunno whose arm it is but that arm take control of danzo's body.

    it's hard to predict chapter 478... in one side i really like to know what happen to naruto, but i also wanna see what happen to itachi (i don't care bout sasuke..)

  7. #17
    The Witcher is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas71 View Post
    Interesting fight, but...Danzo seems rather careless. Come on, I'm sure he doesn't have to rely on his weird kawarimi-ish jutsu to fight, especially since it seems to be using his Sharingans somehow. If the jutsu is limited, then it's rather stupid for him to get hit so easily.
    Danzo's got a thing against showing emotion, so he's probably just being calm even as his situtation grows more desperate. Let's face it, the odds are squarely against him. Even if by some odd chance he beats Sasuke Madara won't let him escape.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas71 View Post
    I don't like Sasuke pulling out a new summon just like that either, but the Itachi theory does make sense...we don't know exactly what Itachi transferred into Sasuke, other than MS jutsus. He could have easily put in some chakra as well, similar to Sasuke absorbing Orochimaru - hence the hawk and Itachi appearing at the end. I will say though, it's quite a Christmas present for Sasuke, whereas Naruto gets nothing this chapter.
    He used the hand seals for Kuchiyose, so it was his own jutsu. My main complaint here that it was unneeded. He could have just used Susanoo to break his fall, it's like he only pulled that out of his ass because there's some unwritten rule that every fight must see at least one new jutsu from the protagonists. And now he's become even more overpowered because he can nuke his enemies from the air in future battles. Kishi is writing himself into a corner here.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicholas71 View Post
    I disagree with your claim that everyone in every forum sees this supposed disparity...although I do agree that Sasuke gets a lot of screen-time and lots of high-level fights, I don't think that degrades Naruto. After all, Naruto being one of the good guys and there being not many bad guys left, he can't really have many Kage-level fights. Whereas Sasuke is being hunted by practically all the Kages. Maybe your measuring stick is just different, but I don't measure how much Kishi favours his characters by the techniques he gives them or the screen-time.

    But if you're talking about the coolness factor...then I get it. Sasuke's the dark dangerous guy with the flashy jutsus, whereas Naruto has recently been grovelling, punched and hyperventilating. But I also take into account the character development, of which Naruto has obviously been benefiting from. Sasuke, who was once cool AND likeable in a warm way back in Part 1, is now...still somewhat cool, but also less warm. I dunno about his fanbase, but I'm sure they can't have approved him leaving Suigetsu and Juugo behind, for one thing.

    Whereas Naruto...he's grown. Last time he would have demanded Raikage not hunt Sasuke, but this time he humbled himself and asked nicely. Didn't work, but it was the right thing to do. Raikage may have liked it more had Naruto shouted, but...he wouldn't have acceded. So no, Naruto has not been looking cool...but he's been earning my respect. I'm actually not anti-Sasuke though, I've liked Sasuke since way back, but he's just got that cool factor, it's always been that way. That's all he's got. Naruto is the kind who quietly earns your respect, if you take the time to see it.
    I've been reading dozens of pages about this chapter on half a dozen different forums, Nick. The general effect on the fanbase is a negative one. Some are complaining like I am, others are cheering or hating on Sasuke for his powerup, but in general there is reduced sympathy for Naruto's character. I understand his message of peace and understand and so on, but rehashing the same thing(Naruto meekly suffering for his ideal) for over 20 chapters will only turn readers off the character, no matter what the explanations are. Just stop it, I've had enough.

    ----

    Like I said in the spoiler thread, that part with Itachi at the end seems to be another of his fail-safes, though it could also be a genjutsu from Sasuke. I'm guessing it's the former, and that this is how Sasuke's final direction in the manga will be revealed.
    I'M NO HERO, BELIEVE IT!

  8. #18
    Nicholas71 is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Witcher View Post
    Danzo's got a thing against showing emotion, so he's probably just being calm even as his situtation grows more desperate. Let's face it, the odds are squarely against him. Even if by some odd chance he beats Sasuke Madara won't let him escape.
    Ah, good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Witcher View Post
    He used the hand seals for Kuchiyose, so it was his own jutsu. My main complaint here that it was unneeded. He could have just used Susanoo to break his fall, it's like he only pulled that out of his ass because there's some unwritten rule that every fight must see at least one new jutsu from the protagonists. And now he's become even more overpowered because he can nuke his enemies from the air in future battles. Kishi is writing himself into a corner here.
    Well even if it's from Itachi, he would still have to do the seals anyway. What I don't get is that if it's from Itachi I wonder how Sasuke knew he had it, unless he tried it out before.

    I think it's not very clever of Kishi to give Sasuke that summon as well...but if he's lost his snake summon then I guess this is the logical progression. Completely agree about his new air strike capabilities, I remember how Naruto had trouble with Deidara because he could fly. But I don't think him using it this battle was unneeded. I've been griping all along about how Sasuke's been spamming MS jutsus like candy for small things. I'd rather use a summon than Susanoo to break my fall, unless Susanoo was already out (was it? If it was then sorry).

    Quote Originally Posted by The Witcher View Post
    I've been reading dozens of pages about this chapter on half a dozen different forums, Nick. The general effect on the fanbase is a negative one. Some are complaining like I am, others are cheering or hating on Sasuke for his powerup, but in general there is reduced sympathy for Naruto's character. I understand his message of peace and understand and so on, but rehashing the same thing(Naruto meekly suffering for his ideal) for over 20 chapters will only turn readers off the character, no matter what the explanations are. Just stop it, I've had enough.
    Hmm. I do know what you mean. I guess what I've been trying to say is that Kishi's not deliberately trying to degrade Naruto, but that maybe he's not doing a good enough job of getting the portrayal through. I totally agree that he's been dragging on Naruto's current predicament for too long. I want to see Naruto moving around again. And get into a fight soon.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Witcher View Post
    Like I said in the spoiler thread, that part with Itachi at the end seems to be another of his fail-safes, though it could also be a genjutsu from Sasuke. I'm guessing it's the former, and that this is how Sasuke's final direction in the manga will be revealed.
    I'm guessing it's really Itachi too. My first thought was that Sasuke was trying to fool Danzo with an Itachi illusion but after that it seemed a bit unlikely - Sasuke doesn't want to talk about Itachi after all, much less use him in a genjutsu. Just like Naruto had his conversation with the 4th, it looks like it's time for Sasuke to talk with Itachi...if Danzo lets him. Hahaha. Danzo seems rather scared though.

  9. #19
    Luphrecio is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    Default madara

    you know, If Madara wasnt such a bad ass villain (except for his stupid end game plan) I would have stopped reading Naruto like I did bleach especially after 20 chapters of Naruto looking like a damn fool, weve already had a year of sasuke, Im frankly tired of seeing him. . . .

    I guess the only REAL manga out there now is One piece *sigh*

    I mean when he pulled that hawk out of his ass I literraly said *wtf* out loud. . .

    Im really really tired of this Sasuke bullshit.

    Im going to have to come back to this manga once Kishi stops Riding Sasukes dick and moves on with the rest of the story
    http://cha30.mybrute.com <-- Try To Fight me, Biatch!

  10. #20
    artifice is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Witcher View Post
    Merry Christmas. I'm guessing Kishit(my present to the mangaka: a well-deserved nickname) must be having a ball, having left his one and only son a new Christmas present.

    It's no secret I'm not at all happy with this manga's direction for the past month, but I'm not the only one. Everyone in every forum can see the blatant disparity in Kishit's treatment of Naruto and Sasuke ever since the Pain arc. While Naruto's been degraded non-stop by portraying him as a pushover, a beggar, a crybaby and an indecisive wimp all in rapid succession, his rival has once again taken centre stage, jumping from one Kage-level fight to another and generally acting like a badass.

    This has pretty much polarised the fanbase: Sasuke fans are pleased to no end and are gleefully pointing out how lame they think Naruto is while others are going into damage control trying to explain Kishit's writing. Ultimately, Naruto lies shafted and facefirst in the snow while Sasuke rises ever higher towards godhood with yet another divine upgrade.

    ....

    Going back to the chapter, Sasuke's new Hawk summon is a huge asspull considering he's been either fighting non-stop or recuperating from said fights ever since Itachi died; short of PNJ he couldn't possibly have had time to look for a summoning contract. Why, Kishi? What was the point? He could just have used Susanoo to break his fall like with the Raikage's powerbomb. It seems to me that Kishi's old decision to strip Sasuke of his snake techniques to balance him with Naruto has been eating him up ever since; out of guilt he's given him a new summon thinking it's the right thing to do; but in doing so he nullified one of Naruto's two remaining advantages! Now Sasuke will be able to nuke his enemies from the air like Deidara! And Naruto who has no ranged jutsu other than the inaccurate Rasenshuriken will need PNJ to beat him...
    I don't know if I would say that the latest chapters have been making Sasuke look like a bad ass. He almost got himself killed by Killerbee, then the Kages, and now he is basically loosing to Danzou. Unless this image of Itachi is Sasuke pulling off a Tsukiyomi to mess with Danzou's head, Sasuke is yet again being saved. I really think that this is just going to show that the younger characters still aren't up to par with their elder counter parts. Just as Minato saved Naruto it is looking like Itachi might be saving Sasuke. Naruto and Sasuke have both grown considerably but, unlike many people seem to think, they still have a long ways to go. Sasuke has the Mangekyou now but other than that he really doesn't seem to be anywhere near Itachi's level in terms of intelligence, ninja skill, etc. The same is true of Naruto in comparison to Jiraiya, he has Sage mode and Rasenshuriken but other than that his skills really don't compare to what Jiraiya's were. Both Naruto and Sasuke still have a lot of growing up to do, they have both just recieved major upgrades in a couple areas.

    I personally think that this is going to be a major transition point for both characters. Naruto is finally realizing that things aren't as simple as he thought and that he is going to need to think more deeply about how to deal with Sasuke. Yet again I think he is going to focus on his training but this time in a much different way with a much different attitude. I believe that Sasuke is also going to realize that he isn't strong enough to just charge straight at his enemies and expect to win. Madara is going to play this to his advantage forcing Sasuke to work with him more as he cannot win on his own. Madara will offer Sasuke the tools he needs to become stronger but at the same time will be bringing him further under his influence.

 

 
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