Thread: Naruto Chp 461 Discussion/462 Predictions

lol
you forget he's under Sasuke's wing.
that guy has the thickest PLOT armour

^funny

i wish juugo n suigetsu will die in this battle..let sasuke and karin run over their ass..

This chapter wasn't bad, really. But I was hoping to see Naruto and Madara.

- I like how Gaara handles himself with the other Kages. I'd say that actually he'd be the best to lead, but it's also true when Mifune said he wouldn't get approval from the others.

- I prefer team battles like the Raikage and Hawk one. It's nicer seeing a combination of techniques rather than a one-on-one battle. So, does the Raikage's shiny aura thing indicate some sort of...chakra aura? It's electric (pardon the pun). But really, can't Sasuke even show a bit of affection for his teammates? He was a little emotional when faced with the Eight Tails (and was losing, incidentally). It was at that point that I thought he was redeemable, because he still showed some compassion, he wanted to save them. Now...who knows.

- I myself never really considered Danzo a villain in the traditional "wholly evil" sense. To me, Danzo has always just been...a politician. He's convinced his way is right and he'd do a lot to get it done, even some underhanded tactics and some trickery. He's also kinda power-hungry. Maybe he'd do some evil things, but I don't think he's entirely evil. No.

- Heck, we all know Sasuke will probably redeem himself, and then either live happily ever after or dying. Killing in cold blood and all is evil, sure, but remember Naruto managed to bring plenty of killers to the light. Zabuza, missing-nin, cold-blooded killer. Gaara, killed who-knows-how-many people, though I suppose you could argue that it wasn't much his fault. Nagato, too. My point is, Sasuke looks irredeemable because it looks like he's making the bad decisions, things that we consider really in his power to do otherwise. While that's true, let's also not forget that he's been manipulated and controlled a lot longer than we think - right from the time Itachi massacred the Uchiha clan. It's a pretty subtle thing, but then again Sasuke's not a very subtle guy. I still don't like him much, and think he can do better, but I think he's redeemable.

- That said, I really really hope Raikage will kick Sasuke around. If the other Kages join the fray eventually and pound Sasuke into retreat, that'd be great.

sasuke did seem to have a plan since he yelled at waterkid and monsterboy for saving him

So...no body is truly selfish and evil and anymore. If they are, I guess they arent very interesting to have a story focus on them. Shitly, everyone major in Naruto has some sort of history to explain their bad mode of being. Im tired of that. I take back I was hoping that Madara become some kinda of hero in disguise, just make him truly evil, and truly own everyone, stop feeding kids dellusional bs such as happy endings and human goodness.

In the real world, most evil selfish people disguide themselve as being good. Thats a kinda story I want to read about! PPl arent born good, nor evil, but they are born to survive, and that my friend will make ppl evil and selfish for the most part. The one that do good deeds because want to balance out the evil inside of them. nothing more.

^I think that is the case in the ninja world. I don't really anyone in Naruto has every proclaimed someone to really be evil. They can be traitors, if they flee their village, they can be enemies, if they're from an opposing village, they can be allies, if they're from friendly villages. But no one has said they're evil. Like you said, in the ninja world it's about survival - they have to kill or be killed. I don't believe the 5 Kages, for instance, regard Akatsuki as evil, but simply as a competitor, something that threatens the village system.

However, for the purposes of shonen manga, there still has to be a villain, so since we see things mostly from Konoha's point, most of their opponents are the evil ones. At most you could say that Akatsuki members were disloyal to their village and had less qualms about killing unnecessarily. In the ninja world that's not evil.

Speaking of Madara though, I think he really is fully 'evil', in the sense that he's not going to be swayed. But I swear, if Naruto somehow manages to convert even Madara to their side...there's just no story anymore. But oddly Madara hasn't acted very villain-ish; no cold-blooded killing, no ruthless acts, no spine-tingling, scary things at all. I think he's begin villain-ish in a more subtle way; manipulating people and circumstances in his favour.

Hidan and Kakuzu were evil. Zabuza was evil. Oro was evil. '

Many people were evil. The only real BIG one that turned out nice and cute was Pain.

My point is only one: ninja world or our world, its not evil to simply fight to survive, kill to survive. True evil is when you act in kindness only to live out a much darker side. Hence, what i mean by evil is the disguise itself. Not even evil as in "serial murder evil", that just mean they are sick, mentally, and then they might have some soft story to explain why they become like that, as with all mental illness.

Now, I was talking about the main villains, when the author use a soft story to explain why they are "bad" (notice being bad is not evil in my terms), such as Oro (recall his parents), Itachi turned out to be good too, Pain, Sasuke, Danzo. Madara is kinda doing bad things, he isnt acting nice to anyone, he manipulate them, thats different from pretending to be nice. HInda, Kakuzu, and Daidara, u can call them pure evil, but that is the trivial kind, you dont really have a story for them.

So all im saying is, in Naruto, there isnt that kind of evil - "pretend to be good" kind of evil, which happen alot in real life. I said I wanted Madara to be truly evil, this time I mean the trivial kind, since I dont care for the one with soft story, and the author isnt wrting about the one I define. Maybe Aizen from Bleach is what I am looking for, before he came out of the closet. Now he is is openly evil...'nough said.

Originally Posted by Yazen

Hidan and Kakuzu were evil. Zabuza was evil. Oro was evil. '

Many people were evil. The only real BIG one that turned out nice and cute was Pain.

Itachi turned out to be nice, too (the whole genocide deal put aside).

I kind of liked this chapter, but mainly for the twist that Juugo's evil is now inside Sasuke. It helps to explain some of Sasuke's irrational behaviour since the 8-tails fight, such as still being so blood thirsty even after the Itachi revelation should have calmed him down somewhat, and also about him wanting to 'crush' konoha and buy Madara's explanation so easily. The sillouette of the shadow inside Sasuke looks similar to the shape of Juugo's fully released form, such as with the shoulder/back spikes coming out.

I'm kind of disappointed in myself for not guessing that at the time when Juugo gave him some skin, and how Juugo hasn't had any problems with his murderous side since then.
This twist kind of means that there's some merit in Sasuke being 'rescued' by Naruto, rather than it just being a case of Sasuke just doing his thing, so it's less annoying that Naruto isn't just leaving him be.