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  1. #101
    black flash's Avatar
    black flash is offline Super Moderator Community Builder
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    ^You said everything I was gonna say no fair. Lol

  2. #102
    BlueDemon is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor View Post
    You can call it plot armour, sure. But wasn't it the same with all the fights Sasuke had in part 2. Fighting sick people, people with an elemental disadvantage, people that didn't even want to beat him and people that only appeared to be beaten by him.
    To me that's also plot armour. So why complain about it when it happens with Naruto, but not with Sasuke? Or even better, why complain at all?
    Thatīs why I donīt wanna join this kind of discussion - the author always decides what he wants to do,so thereīs actually no sense in discussing something like this xD

  3. #103
    The Witcher is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor View Post
    You can call it plot armour, sure. But wasn't it the same with all the fights Sasuke had in part 2. Fighting sick people, people with an elemental disadvantage, people that didn't even want to beat him and people that only appeared to be beaten by him.
    To me that's also plot armour. So why complain about it when it happens with Naruto, but not with Sasuke? Or even better, why complain at all?
    I say 'plot armour' when Kakuzu suddenly turns into a moron and succumbs to the tried and failed 'blitz with a few Kagebunshin' trick. I say 'plot armor' when the circumstances in the Naruto-Pain fight are set to be favourable to Naruto right from the start. Itachi intending to lose also counts as plot armour, I suppose, but the victory against Deidara was entirely due to Sasuke's skill and ingenuity. Elemental disadvantages don't really count as plot armour. You can't say a guy with a gun won against a guy with a sword because his story gave him plot armour. That's just the way of things.

    What I'd like is as kwasi described, for battles here to be decided solely on the characters's skills and ingenuity rather than assistance from the mangaka.
    Naruto's supposed to be conquering all odds. It takes away some of the impact when you know he didn't quite conquer the odds on his own but was helped along by his God.
    I'M NO HERO, BELIEVE IT!

  4. #104
    krazykwasi is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    LOL. Come on Witch.. u gotta admit. Sasuke falls victim to kishi's "plot armour" protection WAY more than naruto.
    Last edited by krazykwasi; 04-08-2009 at 07:15 PM.

    "He is now declaring his words to the WORLD!"

  5. #105
    Feanor is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Well you're probably right about the Deidara fight. An elemental advantage isn't plot amour, really. That's just ninja life. You'll probably have it in a lot of fights.

    But his fights against Itachi, Oro and Killerbee showed definite signs of it.
    And suddenly coming up with "my sharingan can see and give color to chakra, so a few of your tricks (nano- and underground bombs) won't work on me" in the Deidara fight, isn't far from plot armour either. At least in my eyes.
    "For Feanor was made the mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and subtlety alike, of all the Children of Illuvatar, and a bright flame was in him"

  6. #106
    Nicholas71 is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    well, like i said, i actually liked the naruto fight, just that looking back on it, i realized it was tilted in naruto's favour. but realistically i think that its hard to arrange a battle where all circumstances are actually equal for both sides. as much as this isn't real life, it is hard to make sure one side does not have some environmental advantage of circumstantial advantage, unless the battle was a pre-arranged one.

    @witcher, thanks, i get what you mean when that ppl might pick on what i say...so im saying i've got no problem with naruto's fight, just pointing out points, like you said.

    on the other hand, i'd say that a few of sasuke's battles showed sasuke's advantage considerably - orochimaru and itachi. which is why it was never entirely fulfilling, i guess. but i have to say sasuke - deidara was completely to sasuke's own effort. he only had an elemental advantage, but to me that doesn't count.

  7. #107
    The Witcher is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Quote Originally Posted by Feanor View Post
    But his fights against Itachi, Oro and Killerbee showed definite signs of it.
    And suddenly coming up with "my sharingan can see and give color to chakra,
    I remember Kishi faced a lot of flak from readers for that issue. Strange thing is I didn't find it implausible at all. We already saw in Part 1 that the Sharingan can see chakra to a limited extent. It wouldn't be far-fetched for Sasuke to see the countless nano-bombs as a cloud of chakra.
    I'M NO HERO, BELIEVE IT!

  8. #108
    Feanor is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    To me it doesn't. Seeing chakra to some point doesn't come close to seeing it through solid objects (like earth). And nano bombs are very small, which would suggest the chakra that's emmitted by them isn't much bigger. So if I can't see a cloud of nanobombs I can't see the light they emit either. Even if there are countless of them, it's just too small (it doesn't get much smaller than nano).
    But maybe that's just me.
    In any case I liked that fight, regardless if there was plot armour.
    The Oro, Itachi and Killerbee fights not as much, but not because it involved plot armour.
    We knew a long time that Oro vs Sasuke was come on day. And for that it just wasn't enough. It wasn't even a real fight, just disappointing.
    Itachi wanted to loose, but I wanted to see him go all out and show us why he was such a great shinobi at a very young age. But he pretty much just spammed MS.
    And in the killerbee fight I wanted Sasuke's new partners to show us something of what they can do. But they did absolutely nothing.
    "For Feanor was made the mightiest in all parts of body and mind, in valour, in endurance, in beauty, in understanding, in skill, in strength and subtlety alike, of all the Children of Illuvatar, and a bright flame was in him"

 

 
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