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  1. #1
    Arcane Azmadi is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    Default The secret of Akatsuki! (biggest spoiler EVER)

    (DISCLAIMER: This is just a theory, it's not entirely complete and I can't prove anything, but if my theory is correct, I'll spoil many of the biggest plot twists in Naruto. And I have a LOT of confidence in this theory. I've thought about it for hours and carefully checked my sources. So read with caution.)

    There has been a lot of speculation about the identity of two of the members of Akatsuki- the leader and Tobi. Several people have argued that the leader is really the 4th Hokage, while other insist that Tobi is really Kakashi's old friend Uchiha Obito. These people are usually ridiculed -I myself only yesterday spent quite some time arguing that the Akatsuki leader couldn't POSSIBLY be the 4th Hokage- but today I had a revelation that finally tied everything together and made it all make sense. Although I haven't seen the whole puzzle yet, it's as though I found the key piece that lets me fit all the other pieces together.

    (SECOND DISCLAIMER: I don't know if anyone else has suggested this theory before, but I personally haven't seen anyone do so. My apologies if anyone has.)

    I will present my theory in 3 sections:

    THE AKATSUKI LEADER IS REALLY THE FOURTH HOKAGE?

    People who argue this theory usually base it on the fact that the leader has spiky hair, and so did the 4th Hokage. This is not a good basis for an argument. On the other hand, there are a number of points against that are rather notable. Firstly, the Akatsuki leader does NOT look much like the 4th Hokage- although they both have spiky hair, the 4th had long spiky golden hair, almost a mane, while the AL has short spiky auburn hair (as seen on the cover of chapter 317- he's standing up the top). Additionally, the 4th didn't have the facial markings/piercings on either side of his nose that the AL possesses. However, all points along this line or argument are more or less irrelevant, as it has been many years since the 4th was seen and in any case, a skilled ninja's appearance is more or less up to their will. The resemblance is still enough for it to at least be worth considering, even if it is not enough alone.

    There are other factors to be considered. The AL's most significant jutsu, the 'Sealing Technique: Illusionary Dragon Nine Consuming Seals' (the one used to extract the bijuu from the jinchuuriki and seal it within the statue) has notable functional similarities to the 'Dead Demon Consuming Seal' supposedly used by the 4th to seal the kyuubi into Naruto. It is not beyond the bounds of possibility that the former is a deriviative version of the latter meant to SAFELY extract a bijuu (or, in the case of the Sanbi, break it down) and seal it without anyone losing their life. This would explain why it takes several S-ranked shinobi 3 whole days to complete, if they are performing a jutsu that would normally be fatal to a single shinobi performing it hurriedly. Additionally, the AL has a notable knowledge of Konoha's 'Will of Fire' which he explains to Hidan. Finally, the almost excessive mystery sustained around the AL's identity seems to indicate that he is a character known to the series, which is why his identity is being kept a careful secret for now.

    However, the case against can still be strongly built on the fact that the 4th Hokage is dead. Dead as a doornail. Although it might be possible that he survived the Dead Demon Consuming Seal SOMEHOW and faked his own death, he had no motive for doing so. So realistically, the 4th is dead. Additionally, the 4th's personality in NO WAY overlaps with that displayed by the Akatsuki leader: one is the most noble shinobi Konoha has ever known, the other is an evil bastard with plans for global domination. This is an ALMOST unsurmountable obstacle for the theory to overcome- almost, but not quite...

    TOBI IS UCHIHA OBITO?

    There is actually a lot more material evidence for the idea that Tobi is Obito than there is for the 4th/AL theory. Tobi's short, spiky black hair is actually virtually identical to Obito's, he wears a mask with one eyehole on it (on the right; Obito gave his left eye to Kakashi), his goofy, laid-back, carefree attitude resembles Obito's (who has been described as his team's version of Naruto) and their names are VERY similar. However, this theory faces the same impressive obstacle as the 4th/AL theory: Obito is even deader than the 4th. Unlike with the 4th we actually SAW Obito die in the Kakashi gaiden and he had even less motive (and ability!) to fake his own death than the 4th did. Additionally, personality aside Obito is just as unlikely to fall in with a gang of criminals as the 4th would be. However, in a very recent chapter (357) a new piece of evidence arose that might not only overcome this argument, but even turn it backwards.

    In 357, Sasuke attacks Tobi and cuts him down with a single blow. On the very next page, Tobi rises to his feet, completely unfazed by the attack and without even a drop of blood on him. Not even Hidan could boast such durability- he bled all over the place and rather than instant regeneration, simply treated his wounds as annoyances. There has only been one other instance of such regerative power in the series: that displayed by the reanimated 1st and 2nd Hokages in chapter 120, whose bodies simply drifted back together when damaged. This suggest the following:

    What if Obito (and by the same token, the 4th Hokage) were reanimated using 'Summoning: Impure World Resurrection'?

    At the start of the battle between the three hokage, Orochimaru erases the personalities of the 1st and 2nd Hokage. It is not such a stretch to theorize that, as well as ERASING personalities, the controller of the reanimated could REWRITE them as well, or the reanimated one's memories, especially if the controller were a ninja of the caliber found in Akatsuki. If we accept this theory as true for now, the question then becomes: who reanimated them? Although it COULD possibly have been done by Orochimaru, this is EXTREMELY unlikely. Orochimaru resented the 4th, as he had hoped to succeed the 3rd as the new hokage. Additionally, he would have maintained a level of control over the reanimated one even after rewriting the personality, which makes his subordinate position in Akatsuki and his subesquent decision to strike out on his own absurd. Even more notably, there is absolutely NO way in the world Orochimaru would have reanimated a one-eyed Uchiha brat who died years before in a small incident in a much larger war and who didn't even display incredible talent in the first place. However, the Impure World Resurrection was not a technique Orochimaru himself invented (like 'Living Corpse Reincarnation' was) and so could have been used by another ninja. But who?

    THE FINAL MEMBER.

    The final piece in the puzzle, the piece that ties everything together and makes it plausible, is the ninth member of Akatsuki. This member is the biggest secret in Naruto to date- they have not had so much as a single line of dialogue and have only been seen, through a blurred, projected image at Akatsuki meetings, a very small number of times. Surprisingly, there has been little to no speculation about this member's identity.

    I am not going very far out on a limb by suggesting that this final member is a woman. She has a slender build, long light-blue hair (as seen, again, on the cover of chapter 317) and wears a flower in it (as an aside, she appears to be in her mid-20s). Additionally, the reason she hasn't spoken a word so far would be that, assuming she uses normal female speech patterns, it would immediately give away her real gender. Besides, given the number of kunoichi in the series it would be downright odd if Akatsuki didn't have at LEAST one among them. Virtually every ninja team has a kunoichi (Sakura, Tsunade, Hinata, Ino, Tenten, Temari, even Karin). Additionally, these kunoichi frequently have an inclination toward medical nijutsu. So it would not be such a stretch to imagine this final member as the medic-nin of Akatsuki (after all, SOMEONE had to reattach Deidara's arm). As a medic-nin, this member would be the most likely to know the Impure World Resurrection, whether by mastering it herself or learning it from Orochimaru (it may even be possible that Orochimaru himself learned/stole it from her during his time in Akatsuki). This kunoichi may even have sought out Orochimaru in order to learn the technique from him. This would make the most likely candidate for her village of origin to be Konoha, where she would be familiar with Orochimaru and his abilities. However, much has been made of keeping her identity secret up to this point, so her identity is most likely significant, possibly a character who has appeared before but is currently unaccounted for in the Naruto canon.

    The next issue would be her motive for reviving the 4th and Obito. One possibility is that, in reality, this kunoichi is the REAL mind behind Akatsuki. As the Akatsuki members (with the exception of Zetsu the scout) travel in pairs, the kunoichi virtually MUST be travelling with the Akatsuki leader. It is possible that she revived the 4th because she needed his ability to use 'Dead Demon Consuming Seal', or rather, to develop it into the 'Sealing Technique: Illusionary Dragon Nine Consuming Seals' in order to execute Akatsuki's world domination plan and that she is manipulating him from behind. Although this is possible, I find it unlikely. For one thing, it's an absurd amount of effort to go to for such a plan to work and the plan just seems too much like it originated from the AL himself, rather than having been given to him. More importantly, it doesn't explain why Obito was revived. Although it's possible that the 4th requested the mysterious kunoichi revive him too, given his new personality I doubt he'd display such sentimentality. Indeed, the only possible reason anyone could have for reviving Obito would be personal.

    So to recap: for this theory to be sound, the ninth member of Akatsuki would be a reasonably young kunoichi with incredible medical skill (able to detach and reattach a humans' body parts with ease), long, light-coloured hair, who may be from Konoha, is unaccounted for and has a personal reason for reviving not only the 4th Hokage, but also Uchiha Obito.

    Rin.

  2. #2
    diokhan is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    regarding the tobi = obito bit, i can't, for now, agree he's like the re-animated 1st and 2nd hokage. when the 1st and 2nd were reanimated, their clothing was a part of them. hence, it regenearted as well when its damaged.

    however, for tobi, its different. when he first appeared, he did not wear an akatsuki cloak, hence, the cloak ain't a part of him. with that said, when sasuke cut him, if you look carefully, it was a slice that would have cut him in half and sent his upper body flying. his clothes, however, remained untouched.

    now, throwing away the probability that he was reanimated using that watchamacallit jutsu, there's another problem: half of obito was crushed under a rock. i don't remember which side, but if he had given kakashi his left eye, i'd assume his right side was crushed, as was mentioned by another member here.

    now there is a possibility that the other unknown member has a sort of regenerative ability to heal him moments before he died in the past (as how Deidaras arm was re-attached), i will not deny that . but i rather bet the reason tobi's dresses up like that is he has some sort of secret to his jutsu which is visible in plain sight.
    Last edited by diokhan; 06-18-2007 at 12:44 AM.
    Do I have to?

  3. #3
    jinpoo_ is offline Member Newbie
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    would it would be reasonable to say the 9th medical nin is Rin?

    -same age as kakashi, mid twenties

    -konoha nin

    -personal reasons for reviving obito: they were on the same team.

  4. #4
    Nicholas71 is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    I have thought of the idea that Rin might be the ninth member, but I never really thought she was the one who was behind everything. It's a great theory that covers WHY the fourth (if he is AL) is different as well as Tobi's immortality. But there are still some unanswered questions:

    1) Why is Rin not the leader?

    2) Kakashi mentioned that all those close to him were dead. If so, did Rin fake her death?

    3) What would drive her to do all this? If she just wanted to resurrect her friends, then why is Akatsuki after the bijuu to start wars?


    Other than that, good theory.

  5. #5
    Nicholas71 is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    Also, another point you left out. Why was Kakashi Gaiden not shown in the anime, skipping straight to Shippuuden instead? To hide the voice of the 4th? You never know.

    And for the record, Zetsu was once Konoha's Green Beast, and
    Hidan's gonna dig his way out(yes, with his head)

  6. #6
    diokhan is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    i doubt the 4th would have such a deep voice as shown in the anime for AL, so hiding his voice when he was younger is useless.

    Kakashi gaiden has more potential to be used as a "canonic filler" as i'd like to call it where, when the anime catches up to the manga, they can show us just that.

    or even better than that; make a naruto movie based out of the kakashi gaiden

    btw, nick, (can i call you nick?) run away. quick. you're so gonna get flamed for the double post....
    Do I have to?

  7. #7
    elnino19 is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    i dont actually agree,but ok
    so ur theory is rin used reanimate no jutsu(there are plenty of them lying around) to bring back and rewrite the 4th's and tobi's personalities;and bring them back to life,and form akatsuki.
    why?
    only thing i can think of is that she wanted to end all wars because wars cost her her friend obito.and she has a thing against bijuus for the same reason.
    the plan to take over the world is also not the traditional steamroller-action-crushing-all strategy,so its not that hypocritical.its a good theory with no proof.
    and no spoilers here.
    Last edited by elnino19; 06-18-2007 at 02:14 AM.

  8. #8
    heshamaru is offline Member Frequent Poster
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    in the anime when they show kakashi team in the fight between the third and orochimarau did Rin have blue hair idon't rember but i think no

    your theory is good but it has a lot of holes you need to fil
    i like the theory but i think it is wrong Rin has no motive to create a criminal
    organization to control the world

  9. #9
    Tsukumaru is offline Senior Member Respected Member
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    I'm glad this thread was made since I posted some stuff earlier but no one was really interested in debating the topic.

    I just want to add to this thread what I had written on the topic:

    Obito:

    I went back and looked at the kakashi gaiden again and found that it was never shown if Obito's right eye was crushed. It was always just covered. If you look closely, you could see that the rock on Obito is shaped so that there's a curve that creates a gap right above obito's right eye on one of the pages.

    Anyways, the point is that if Obito = Tobi, a good chuck of his right side could be made of something else, which would explain how his survived Sasuke's hit.

    The body of Obito was ever collected at the time of his "death" 13 years ago.

    The only people we were told who knew about Obito's death were Kakashi, Rin, and the 4th. The one other person who could have known without being told of Obito's death is Zetsu, since he can merge with ground and forest to spy on others. Besides, Zetsu is like the hunter-nin that collects corpses and stuff, i read it on wikipedia.

    1) The 4th went back to get Obito's body or ordered Zetsu to get Obito's body, given the 4th is AL. Obito's body was reconstructed by someone.

    2) Zetsu was spyin' on the 4th and his team the whole time. Zetsu could have been working for some1 else (old akatsuki?) and was ordered to spy on Konoha's Yellow Flash. At this point, Zetsu and the 4th are not related at all. Zetsu took Obito's body and had someone fix him up. After the 4th became AL, Obito was working for Zetsu and the 4th got some face change.

    So adding Arcane Azmadi's part of the theory, Obito could have been recontructed by the 9th member. The 9th being a med-nin isn't far-fetched at all, but the idea that that person is Rin is questionable. She is neither a genius nor blessed with a powerful bloodline ability, so how could she be in Akatsuki? Her motives for joining Akatsuki is another thing that doesn't make sense.

    I starting to doubt the 4th = AL. If you recall back to the time during Orochimaru was trying to summon the past hokage, the 4th wasn't summoned. Orochimaru had planned for the invasion for a long time so theres no way he would not have made sure that the summoning of the 4th with the Impure World Resurrection was possible to begin with. Impure World Resurrection connects a human shell with the soul of the dead. At that time, we can be sure that Akatsuki existed and so did the AL. So is it still possible that 4th = AL when the 4th's soul was not even on the human world? Yes, it is since in the manga, the person within the coffin was nevered mentioned and it was only in the anime did the last coffin bear the name "The 4th".

  10. #10
    Masterfilth is offline Senior Member Frequent Poster
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcane Azmadi View Post
    (DISCLAIMER: This is just a theory
    Dude, if its a theory then its not a spoiler cause we don't know that its true

    Additionally, the 4th didn't have the facial markings/piercings on either side of his nose that the AL possesses.
    Seriously, that is a crap reason. 15 years have passed since the 4th died. I don't think it'd be unusual for him to change just a bit.
    But I don't believe he is AL anyway.

    Additionally, the AL has a notable knowledge of Konoha's 'Will of Fire' which he explains to Hidan.
    I don't think thats a good point to argue. If Hidan came back, he would also know of Konoha's Will of Fire, because of Shikamaru. All it means is that AL was either close to Konoha or had very close encounters.

    Finally, the almost excessive mystery sustained around the AL's identity seems to indicate that he is a character known to the series, which is why his identity is being kept a careful secret for now.
    I don't see where you got that impression from.

    Obito is even deader than the 4th. Unlike with the 4th we actually SAW Obito die in the Kakashi gaiden and he had even less motive (and ability!) to fake his own death than the 4th did. Additionally, personality aside Obito is just as unlikely to fall in with a gang of criminals as the 4th would be.
    Several things here: We didn't see Obito die, we saw him get crushed. This is where my theory comes into place a bit. I think Zetsu had something to do with Obito's comeback. He was formerly Zetsu's subordinate. Zetsu could have saved him from the rock and trained and coerced him. Lust for power, money, any of these could have made Obito want to become Akatsuki.
    But that's just my theory.


    So it would not be such a stretch to imagine this final member as the medic-nin of Akatsuki (after all, SOMEONE had to reattach Deidara's arm).
    Wrong. Kakuzu reattached Deidara's arm. Theres a reference to it when they are sealing the nibi and sanbi. We also saw in chapter 355 (i think) that Deidara had the black string markings that Kakuzu's body was made from on his arm. The only weird thing is that there is some weird crap where the elbow should be. Remember Kakashi warped his elbow into another dimension.
    Kakuzu also reattached Hidan's head after Asuma cut it off.

    so her identity is most likely significant, possibly a character who has appeared before but is currently unaccounted for in the Naruto canon.
    So according to your theory we know every member of Akatsuki? That would be really boring if it were true.

    Also, that would mean that there are 5 members that come from Konoha. Including Orochimaru. Which is very unlikely.

 

 
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