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  1. #101
    Krytha is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks View Post
    In the states, it takes a longgggggggggg time to become a doctor. Like 11yrs or so. 4 years in college. 4 years in med school. and then like 3 yrs in residency.

    But, even still, you got different rankings. You got those who get a DO degree and those who gets their MD degree. Often, those with a DO degree are more frowned upon because of the reputation that a MD is better then a DO degree.

    There IS a difference in the type of service you get!!

    I don't know about you, but personally if I had a serious medical problem I would choose the older doctor about to retire instead of the doctor just coming out of his residency. There's more years of experience on his belt.
    Doctor training is the same everywhere in Canada. Everyone goes through the same steps. The only way you're treating someone under OHIP is if you have your MD. And there isn't any difference. If you had a serious medical problem, the only thing that would change would be the specialization of the person.

    See, this is a problem for you in the states with your privatization, but I'm totally unconcerned with who I see because I am confident in my country's HC system. If having peace of mind is a rating system that could be used, Canada's HC would win outright, it would seem.

  2. #102
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    Jakko is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krytha View Post
    Doctor training is the same everywhere in Canada. Everyone goes through the same steps. The only way you're treating someone under OHIP is if you have your MD. And there isn't any difference. If you had a serious medical problem, the only thing that would change would be the specialization of the person.

    See, this is a problem for you in the states with your privatization, but I'm totally unconcerned with who I see because I am confident in my country's HC system. If having peace of mind is a rating system that could be used, Canada's HC would win outright, it would seem.
    Last time I checked, the people on the Titanic had peace of mind when they set out on their voyage, too.

    Seriously, stop making idiotic comments, both you and I know you are a smart guy, stop it.

    Peace of mind is an illusion for fools. There is no such thing as true safety in life, and only the foolish feel they have peace of mind. Placidity is the smoke and mirrors of the simple minded. I am with CPR on this.

    the last i checked, that's a bad thing =\
    True. I will repeat, for the record, guys, that though I am a Republican, I am also an isolationist. I want our military to have as little to do without outside countries as possible. Heck, I want our government to have as little to do with other countries as possible(I also want them to have as little to do with me as possible, namely, I want less government).

  3. #103
    Krytha is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Whoa there cowboy. I wasn't saying it was a rating system, I was saying if it could be used we would have a winner. CPR is obviously worried about who she sees, I'm not. Therefore, if it were a scale, I win.

    Yup, that's all there was to it.

  4. #104
    deuce22 is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bs_LBXD69w

    kind of goes with the subject of the thread....not the arguing, but a portion of it is relevant to the medical issues.


  5. #105
    Schiljo is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks View Post
    O_o

    .5-1%?! Dude, that's REALLY idealistic for a capitalistic society.

    The ideal statistic for unemployment rate is like 3-5%. Naturally, if people don't even have JOBS they obviously won't be trying to afford health insurance.


    Our gov't doesn't have enough money to fund a free healthcare for all. We have many many more people then places like Japan, Canada, or UK that have those free healthcare systems. Heck, we don't have enough money to pay for our social security so there's no way Congress will EVER CONSIDER making a free healthcare system.
    Even if you`re unemployed the social health care is there in most countries.

    And the government doesn`t fund healthcare. You have a special tax which goes into pays and such. It`s not like the government pays for it cpr. They just distribute the cash sorta.

  6. #106
    Saizou is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Quote Originally Posted by StealDragon
    Because most conservatives I speak with always bring morality into a discussion as if their personal feelings should have some effect on me and what I believe in. So for me to do the same thing feels hypocritical, however it is the only way (since in this case I am unfamiliar with the stats) that I can justify my point. Furthermore since the insurance companies are committing no actual crime, it does fall to morality to be the way to get change enacted.
    But isn't politics really a practical application of morality? After all, we're discussing whether a certain way of doing things is right or not. The stats and numbers are merely a way for us to prove our reasoning.

    Incidentally, the point that I have been arguing for the entire time is by its nature a moral one. Basically, my morals tell me that it's right to give people the highest quality of life possible, and based on that I have come to the conclusion that a socialized model is the best one possible.

    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks View Post
    O_o

    .5-1%?! Dude, that's REALLY idealistic for a capitalistic society.
    All I've said is that I find it unlikely that more than 1% of the population would be uninsured if ignorance is the only explanation.

    However, I do agree with you that people get shafted under capitalism. That's why I don't support it.

    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks
    The ideal statistic for unemployment rate is like 3-5%. Naturally, if people don't even have JOBS they obviously won't be trying to afford health insurance.
    If they don't have jobs they're eligible for Medicaid, are they not?

    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks
    Like everything in life, it works for some, and not for others. Nothing is flawless. Medicare worked for my grandma... so... meh. =P

    There's probably a bunch of flaws in our system, but it does somewhat work.
    But there are more and less flawed systems, yes? The point here is that you could easily fix many flaws by implementing a socialized model.

    Quote Originally Posted by coolpuprocks
    Our gov't doesn't have enough money to fund a free healthcare for all. We have many many more people then places like Japan, Canada, or UK that have those free healthcare systems. Heck, we don't have enough money to pay for our social security so there's no way Congress will EVER CONSIDER making a free healthcare system.
    In fact, you do have more than enough money to fund universal healthcare. I posted this before, but here are the numbers.

    The graph on page three shows that you're already paying more per person than any other civilized country does. So don't tell me you don't have the money. An universal model would simply be funded by taxes, much like any government spending.

  7. #107
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    shautieh is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    Quote Originally Posted by child_of_serenity View Post
    Come now, Japans health care system for years just wouldn't tell their patents if they had cancer. They'd give them things to reduce symptoms and just let them die in peace.
    in the meantime japan has by far the longest life expectancy of all, so this couldn't be so bad. Also, if a person of 70 or 80 years old was diagnosed with cancer there would be no point to try to even try to cure them except to keep them in peace (though i agree they should at least tell them about it).

    In fact, you do have more than enough money to fund universal healthcare. I posted this before, but here are the numbers.

    The graph on page three shows that you're already paying more per person than any other civilized country does. So don't tell me you don't have the money.
    ^ i think it will be more visible bolded, as few seem to read it, repeatedly :P

  8. #108
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    StealDragon is offline Super Moderator Community Builder
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jakko View Post
    Peace of mind is an illusion for fools. There is no such thing as true safety in life, and only the foolish feel they have peace of mind. Placidity is the smoke and mirrors of the simple minded. I am with CPR on this.
    I'd like to inject that Jakko I disagree with this comment. Peace of mind is not foolish. Certain groups of people seem to have a hard time understanding this but alot of people don't like living in fear that at any moment they could be attacked. True as it may be, it's not healthy. So putting thoughts like that out of your head or just not caring ... I doubt thats foolish. Damnit the last thing we need is a country walking around with 300 million super paranoid citizens.

    And its not always placidity. Sometimes its apathy. Ive reserved myself the the fact that Jihad and the like will always threaten our country. Yet I don't really care. There is naught I can truly do to stop it, and walking around with my head to the sky searching for planes is not going to help. Bah. Before I digress, saying peace of mind is and illusion for fools is like saying its crazy to be calm in a time of turmoil. Worrying isn't going to do anything.


    I'd like to die with the songs I love stuck in my head. I hope to make the most of these hollow bones we become.
    I raise a toast to the the souls that sang all along. I've been gathering friends to just to make some sounds,
    before the ship goes down, I've been making amends by making the rounds before the whole world ends


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  9. #109
    echoblaze is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jakko View Post
    Peace of mind is an illusion for fools. There is no such thing as true safety in life, and only the foolish feel they have peace of mind. Placidity is the smoke and mirrors of the simple minded. I am with CPR on this.
    if this is the case, then wouldn't CPR be wrong, as even if you choose some uber-expensive doctor, something can still go wrong ? if we're going to be fearful anyway, why not go with a socialized model ?

    and actually, fear is what governments want their proletariat to think - people that are afraid are easier to control.

  10. #110
    Henchy432 is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    Geeze, I saw that happines of health care in Denmark, wow. I should of moved there when I had the chance. If you excuse me, I have to paid $75 to get my back fixed.

 

 
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