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  1. #31
    Heartlessfang is offline Senior Member Long Time Member
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    also on the Aizen thing: he is too arrogant of a prick to simply kill all of his enemies. It's even worse now with the condom+mullet transformations he just got.

    "You have other hearts trapped within you as well, dont you?"
    "You're that guy from last time! What are you talking about?!"
    "The other Hearts within you."
    "Hearts trapped within me....?"

  2. #32
    reaperzeero is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rumina Asagi View Post
    If a plus is left alone without being guided to the soul society, it eventually becomes a hollow.

    A plus consumed by a hollow is destroyed, adding whatever spiritual pressure it has to the power of the hollow.
    Well at least in the anime they clearly show Inoue's bros soul being eaten and then him turning into a hollow but whatever.

  3. #33
    Cueny is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rumina Asagi View Post
    The power meter, yes. The speed meter? Technically not. it's supposed to be defined by the power meter. While that has been warped and skewed, the stronger someone iis supposed to be, the faster the speed of their movement. Essentially everyone moving faster than Ichigo's Bankai is because they are supposed to be stronger than him.
    The stronger someone it's supposed to be, the faster the speed of their movement. This's not true. Everyone have their weak and strong side. It's clearly that the espada no.7 is the fastest one of all the espada. He said it himself.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/299/12/

    Like no.5 said he's the best heiro. Or no.4 said he's best in regeneration.

    If Byakuya's fast enough to reacts no.7 who has the fastest speed, it should be no problem for Ichigo with the others espada. Because he's faster than Byakuya.(no mask and recently achieved bankai.) But Ichigo can't keep up to whatever enemies he face, this is what I called "speed meter gone wild."

    Also, it's his bankai's abilities which help him enhanced his speed. It's an unique abilities that the others don't have. If he got stronger, it's logically that he can use his bankai abilities more effectively. But he's slow as hell now.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rumina Asagi View Post
    This is given in the introduction arc as something any soul reaper can do.
    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/63/09/
    In a hundred chapters of SS arc. no one fight on the air. And you can't fly freely in that arc. You have to used Yoruichi's cloak, dragon wing, etc. if you want to. If they can do that so why didn't they do it at all in SS arc. They even have to use a tool for it. And so suddenly they can fly without it. Very strange.

    I don't understand what a chapter 63 can do or can explain a whole plot hole. If there are a chapter 63 here, or there aren't here. The same plot hole still exist. Nothing changed at all.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rumina Asagi View Post
    Byakuya was retarded in that whole match. It only ended in ichigo's victory because of his attitude in general. Byakuya refused to think of him as a threat, and so held back. Same with Zaraki. If either had been fighting seriously, Ichigo would be dead. In addition, Ichigo's raw power potential is supposed to be double that of a captain - it doesn't mean he's tapping into it properly. We saw Shunsui take out Stark with his Shikai because Shunsui simply outclasses Ichigo.
    Yeah, Shunsui simply outclasses Ichigo. He can take out no.1 espada with shikai. But Byakuya, he used all three versions of his bankai to fight with Ichigo and said Ichigo was the second one who see this, so I don't think he was held back.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/164/13/

    For Zaraki, he got a huge power up from the writer. While Ichigo fighting as hard as he can(with bankai and mask) to win no.6, while Zaraki win no.5 with a tough warm up and two hands. Not much sense here since Ichigo fight Zaraki by his incomplete shikai and both of their face was on the ground at the end. At that time, Ichigo can't even use Getsuga Tensho yet.

    And about Ichigo's raw power potential is supposed to be double that of a captain. I can't find any information about this and I never heard of it until now. Because the captains level itself is so difference to each other. I clearly remember that he has a huge sword because he can't control his raistu properly.
    Last edited by Cueny; 06-23-2010 at 12:16 PM.

  4. #34
    Yazen is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Two things Cueny. Hueco Mundo and Soul Society are not the same planes of reality. Therefore it can be explained (relatively) easily that the amount spirit particles is different in density.

    Two if we look at it as Byakuya not having held out during all three releases then we look at it like this.
    Release- He starts out slow and lets Ichigo taste. Here Ichigo may have been on par with him.

    Bankai- he could have killed him while Ichigo was powering up or even after the first strike. Honorable, so he holds out. Ichigo doesn't kill Byakuya the first time for honor as well. It was actually pretty stale between them after because Byakuya still fought without his arms for half the match.

    Second form- He even said himself "dont worry I won't fight you with all of these swords" or something along those lines. This shows that he could have skewered Ichigo from a thousand angles before his hollow side showed up. He was even slowing down so it was easy. What stopped him wasn't honor because at this point they would be equal. He just looked down upon him.


    Has absolutely nothing to with the chapter. Just so bodily exhausted.

  5. #35
    Cueny is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yazen View Post
    Hueco Mundo and Soul Society are not the same planes of reality. Therefore it can be explained (relatively) easily that the amount spirit particles is different in density.
    - If you're talking about flying characters issue. Only after SS arc, they can fly in the air of SS as well. So the spirit particles theory doesn't works with this issue.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/315/09/ >>> http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/315/14/


    - If you're talking about power/speed meter issue. I wonder why it effected in a difference way to a difference character.


    Sorry if I made some of you boring. I am really sorry. T-T

    Next time, I will talking about chapter 409 in the 409 threat.

  6. #36
    Rumina Asagi is offline Senior Member Frequent Poster
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cueny View Post
    The stronger someone it's supposed to be, the faster the speed of their movement. This's not true. Everyone have their weak and strong side. It's clearly that the espada no.7 is the fastest one of all the espada. He said it himself.

    http://www.onemanga.com/Bleach/299/12/

    Like no.5 said he's the best heiro. Or no.4 said he's best in regeneration.

    If Byakuya's fast enough to reacts no.7 who has the fastest speed, it should be no problem for Ichigo with the others espada. Because he's faster than Byakuya.(no mask and recently achieved bankai.) But Ichigo can't keep up to whatever enemies he face, this is what I called "speed meter gone wild."

    Also, it's his bankai's abilities which help him enhanced his speed. It's an unique abilities that the others don't have. If he got stronger, it's logically that he can use his bankai abilities more effectively. But he's slow as hell now.
    Now compare the fact that, in exceptions of people with similar powers specialising in speed/power/regeneration, etc. when anyone outclassing another character HASN'T moved faster than the weaker character can possibly track them without increasing their own spiritual pressure to attempt to match it. The only one I can even think of is the menos Grande that attacked Karakura Town. and in general those things are meant to be slow as hell.

    Also, Ichigo hasn't slowed down, AT ALL. His enemies have sped up. This is a different situation compared to Sokyoku Hill. Byakuya had to use all three forms of his bankai because he refused to take ichigo seriously, and left tons of openings that you wouldn't see with any opponent considered a threat. But then, I already outlined that it was Byakuya's pride that allowed Ichigo to win. Same thing happened with Zaraki, in reference to your mentioning of Zaraki vs. Nnoitra.

    In a hundred chapters of SS arc. no one fight on the air. And you can't fly freely in that arc. You have to used Yoruichi's cloak, dragon wing, etc. if you want to. If they can do that so why didn't they do it at all in SS arc. They even have to use a tool for it. And so suddenly they can fly without it. Very strange.
    They DIDN'T fly. Doesn't mean the COULDN'T. Yoruichi's cloak was a plot device to make Ichigo's appearance at the bridge more dramatic/cooler than it woulda been if he'd simply leapt up there, or ran. It also allowed him to respond to the threat in a much quicker timeframe than he could've done in his state at the time.

    I don't understand what a chapter 63 can do or can explain a whole plot hole. If there are a chapter 63 here, or there aren't here. The same plot hole still exist. Nothing changed at all.
    Explicitly stating that soul reapers have the ability to walk on the air by use of spirit particles under their feet has nothing to do with explaining battles fought in the air...? >_>

    Yeah, Shunsui simply outclasses Ichigo. He can take out no.1 espada with shikai. But Byakuya, he used all three versions of his bankai to fight with Ichigo and said Ichigo was the second one who see this, so I don't think he was held back.

    For Zaraki, he got a huge power up from the writer. While Ichigo fighting as hard as he can(with bankai and mask) to win no.6, while Zaraki win no.5 with a tough warm up and two hands. Not much sense here since Ichigo fight Zaraki by his incomplete shikai and both of their face was on the ground at the end. At that time, Ichigo can't even use Getsuga Tensho yet.
    As explained by myself, and by Yazen. Byakuya wasn't held back. He held himself back. Same with Zaraki. But hey, it's only bluntly stated that he does that for the lulz. I mean, the kendo swing bs woulda totally made sense to cleave the protagonist in two during the main arc of the series, right?

    And about Ichigo's raw power potential is supposed to be double that of a captain. I can't find any information about this and I never heard of it until now. Because the captains level itself is so difference to each other. I clearly remember that he has a huge sword because he can't control his raistu properly.
    It's been hinted at multiple times. You need to read between the lines of what is explicitly being stated. Several captains have commented on his raw power potential. The raw power thing has been alluded to ever since the Menos Grande attacked Karakura, and Uryu did that freaky thing where he channeled Zangetsu's power into his bow.

    Reaper, the anime has several minor differences with the manga. AFAIK, not many have been retconned into existence as lore in the manga.

  7. #37
    Cueny is offline Senior Member Regular
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    @Rumina Asagi


    - You said "The stronger someone it's supposed to be, the faster the speed of their movement." and I said "It's not true.". Not only the Menos Grande slow as hell, the strongest espada Yammi released form too. This is the proof from the fact appeared in the story, not my own thinking. To think like "The stronger someone it's supposed to be, the faster the speed of their movement." is totally wrong.

    - I didn't think that Byakuya had to use his bankai 3 forms cause from his handicap he gave to Ichigo, not to mention he didn't take Ichigo seriously. He already used 2 hands to control his bankai(first form) and Ichigo still outclass him which make him to go to second form. This is also the proof from the fact appeared in the story, not my own thinking.

    - Ichigo, even after he gained his bankai, he still cannot cut though an espada no.6's skin. What do you think Zaraki can do to the no.5 who has the toughest skin, if he's not got a huge power boost from the writer? It's time to give up already.

    - Ichigo didn't slow down, why did you think that? It's not related to Byakuya released his bankai. If Ichigo already outclass Byakuya's speed so why he can't with others espada he fought, he didn't fight with the fastest espada anyway. If he had to use bankai and mask to overcome no.6's speed so it's no hope for Byakuya to fight no.7 who's the fastest espada of all.

    - "They DIDN'T fly. Doesn't mean the COULDN'T.", yeah it's true but only after a hundred chapters of SS arc. I really want to know who taught them how to fly, maybe Zangestu came out and taught them himself. And it doesn't make sense in many part of the story. And one of that is, How will you explain Yumichiga and Ganju fight?, Will Ganju ability become another plot hole?(Or it already is)

    - Only Ichigo's talent was presents by many characters.(Not need to use a hints!) And I knew that Ichigo's raw power/reaistu was high, but not sure if it's by double as the captains as you said before.


    Sorry, I only see your own thinking from your explanation, not much fact and sense there.

    Regard, Cueny.
    Last edited by Cueny; 07-07-2010 at 11:09 PM. Reason: Grammar

 

 
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