Has anyone ever discussed what Zangetsu is exactly? He's not like normal Zanpakuto at all. He's got split personalities and seems to help out Ichigo more than other sword users.
It can't be said that Ichigo was the main reason for his power up. Zangetsu fed him a lot.
Point is that something that maybe Urahara did messed with his zanpakuto and somehow this is going to lead to a hybrid theory because instead of shinigami/hollowification it's a zanpakuto/hollow cross.
Some may say it's any vizard who does it. But we can't say for sure whether the vizards were fighting their inner hollow or their zanpakuto's hollow. Ichigo and ManGetsu could be connected and have the same hollow side. It's 3 am here. give it slack.
You are thinking to much.
1. Zangetsu is Ichigos Zanpakuto.
2. White Ichigo is Ichigos Hollow side. His complete opposite side.
3. Both are IN him.
Whenever he decides to rely on Zangetsu he is normal, whenever he relys on his Hollow side he is a Vizard/Hollow... depends on how much he lets Wichigo take over (Ulquiora fight - complete Hollow transformation).
Other Shinigami DONT even have a Hollow inside of them, so they cant transform into anything because there is a physical barrier to their Hollow side, which only the Hyougoku can remove.
I didn't mean shinigami. It was 3 am when I wrote that. I meant the vizards. Also you sort of missed the point because White Ichigo is also Zangetsu. They are one and the same. Split sides. That's what I mean.
Zangetsu is his Shinigami power, Wichigo is his Hollow power.
And naturally they are the splitsides of each other.
Other Shinigamis have only their Shinigami spirit, since their Hollow spirit is kind of sealed up.
Shinigami: have only Shinigami side
Hollow: have only Hollow side
Vizards: have both, domination is Shinigami side
Arrancar: have both, domination Hollow side
Chrissake I don't need a damn explanation. You know what you're talking about but you have no clue what I'm talking about so you assume I'm an imbecile.
You are a damn imbecile cuz you donīt get what he means xD
The other Vizards have probably the same "problem" as Ichigo - The hollow and shinigami part is melted -> thatīs what you also said...
I donīt really understand your last sentence, but why should the other Vizards fight their Shinigami side (->Zanpaktou)?
Ok. For one thing I'm not an imbecile because you guys are getting pretty off course. The whole point of this thread was to discuss the ONE unique zanpakuto Zangetsu. Nothing to do with other vizards or shinigami. Only that Ichigo and Zangetsu may not have the same type of "relationship" that the other vizards have. And who's to necessarily say that all the other vizard's zanpakutos can revert from inner hollow to regular avatar.
Personally I think it's just Zangetsu that does this.
And I do get what he means I don't need a crap cookie cutter explanation wtf vizards and arrancars are.
FFS I'm just fucking talking about Zangetsu.
Kill the thread I can't stand this shit.
For one thing you are one cuz I knew you would just ignore the "xD" I put there. I wanted to say in brackets that you shouldnīt take it seriously, but oh well....
And whereīs the sense in speculating about Ichigoīs Zanpaktou? As long as we donīt have any info on the otherīs inner hollow/zanpaktou, we canīt really say anything.
And I for one think itīs the same for everybody. Of course, I could be wrong since Ichigo is the main char and heīs pretty unique etc.
Oh, and another thing. Donīt take it all too seriously....
Devil's Advocate Activate!
There is a chance that Ichigo himself is at least somewhat unique. While the Vaizard's were able to put Ichigo into the same "hollow trial" that they went through, he still has that one distinction that separates him from all the others: He began as a plus, almost became a hollow, and then was able to find the part of him that remembered his few moments as a Shinigami.
Ichigo himself seems to blur the line between Arrancar and Vaizard as we saw during the Ulquiorra fight. He wasn't a shinigami calling on hollow powers. He was a full hollow using a sword.
While I agree with everything you've said otherwise, this specific example is very much up to debate.
Originally Posted by neruke
As far as we know, from the dialogue and events of chapters past, Zangetsu is now just a submissive part inside of Wichigo and not able to be projected outward any longer.
Secondly, the Ichigo/Ulquiorra didn't seem so much like him "relying on Wichigo" as much as he simply died and the hollow part of him converted his soul to hollow instantly to save itself. The Wichigo we know isn't a cold, calculating monster. He's a talkative, laughing, gloating one.
You bring up a good point. Hichigo is a sadistic beast, enjoying to beat revenge into whoever made him come out (probably not so much a trait to protect ichigo, but rather to show that he's better than ichigo, a bit of a ''wtf are you doing, here's how it's done!'' attitude. The fight with byakya pretty much expressed exactly that :P) whereas the full transformation was just brutal, like the Angel Transformation of Tales of Symphonia, as a grounds for comparison.
It was more like ''Come near me and i'll kill you'', than ''you aren't worthy of ruling over me, watch this!''
As for the theory in the first post, it would be reliant on the Zanpakuto and it's wielder being seperate spiritual entities. Technically, while each one is an individual, they are not a single entity. A zanpakuto and it's owner are the same thing, the blade being a representation of it's wielder's spiritual pressure. Basically, Zangetsu is so unique because Ichigo himself is.
Of course, until it's clarified whether the characteristics of communication with them are different for Soul Reapers/Arrancars/Vaizards, we pretty much have to assume that ichigo and zangetsu are unique entities, and that nothing else is really like them in the bleach universe.