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  1. #11
    StealDragon's Avatar
    StealDragon is offline Super Moderator Community Builder
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    Instead of saying because of Byakuya, the espada must be leaps and bounds ahead of the other SS captains consider this. Byakuya is a NEW captain. I seriously doubt hes stronger than half the other captains - imho Soi Fong would own him since once you take away his speed hes really just got ... his bankai, and that can be evaded but i dont even think he could go that far before getting hit twice especially with Soi Fongs speed. So trying to make this theory is kinda like saying A > B, C > A, so C > A is way too simplified. There are other things to take into account.

    Do I think any of the current espada could take on Shunsui, Zyuushiro, Shigekuni, Kurotsuchi, Kenpachi, etc and win... No.


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  2. #12
    gummyworms is offline Senior Member Regular
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    aizen is probably more power than the arrancar esperda in his current form since he's like this genius that already learned all the arts. On the other hand, those arts are also familiar to the top captains of shingamis, so thats why he needs the esperda and other arrancar to be the footsoldiers for him to fight against the shinigami.

  3. #13
    SixthAngel is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Quote Originally Posted by StealDragon View Post
    Instead of saying because of Byakuya, the espada must be leaps and bounds ahead of the other SS captains consider this. Byakuya is a NEW captain. I seriously doubt hes stronger than half the other captains - imho Soi Fong would own him since once you take away his speed hes really just got ... his bankai, and that can be evaded but i dont even think he could go that far before getting hit twice especially with Soi Fongs speed.
    Actually you can't really dodge his bankai unless you have some special bankai speed like Ichigo. Soi Fong's speed as well as pretty much any other character can't match Ichigo's bankai speed.

    The espada are stronger then the SS captains. They were powerful hollows who also gained shinigami powers on top of that. Vaastrode's are basically captain level hollows, which Ulquiorra has been hinted at being, and they have shinigami powers on top of being so strong already.

  4. #14
    Urameshi-sama is offline Senior Member Community Builder
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    It would seem that the espada are way stronger than the shinigami captains if we use Ichigo as reference, but we really didn't see much SS captain action with Ichigo. He took down one captain in semi-bankai mode and stalemated another one with his bankai, but does that really account for all of them? Even among the ones Ichigo "defeated", we don't know their true powers. Byakuya had enough strength to speed to his sister's rescue after their battle; I don't think he really tried in the battle.

  5. #15
    sasuke_uzumaki111222 is offline Senior Member Respected Member
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    Semi bankai?

  6. #16
    Nishi Tetsu is offline Senior Member Regular
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    Didn't it say in the manga that Aizen is 2x as strong as a Captain?

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  7. #17
    erachima is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    The captain-class shinigami that we have seen get into protracted fights so far have all been on par with adjuchas-based hybrids. There's nothing surprising about this, since adjuchas menos are supposed to be lieutenant-level and the hybridization is supposed to give them a major boost. If they were any weaker, one would seriously wonder why Aizen was wasting his time with adjuchas in the first place.

    Now another thing to realize is that we have never seen any of the strongest captains fight. Yes, Byakuya and Kenpachi were considered main players in Soul Society, but that's because Byakuya is head of a noble house (huge political influence and whatever) and Kenpachi is the leader of the strongest overall squad. As far as individual power goes, they're not even in the top third of the captains, possibly dead center in the rankings if Unohana and Gin are as strong as they seem implied to be. So the higher captains like Yamamato and Ukitake could probably take out adjuchas-based arrancar with ease, and we all saw the effect of Aizen's reiatsu crush he used vs. Grimmjow.

    In the end, the power classes are roughly like this: (Examples of characters in these groups in parentheses.)

    1. 100% hogyoku-created vastorode arrancar and the strongest vizards. (Espada generation 3, Ichigo and Aizen at the end of the series)
    2. Existing vastorode arrancar, strong vizards, and maxed-out pure shinigami. (Ulquiorra, Shinji, Yamamato, Aizen now, etc.)
    3. Adjuchas arrancar, natural vastorodes, strong captain-level shinigami, probably most vizards. (Grimmjow, Byakuya, Ichigo at end of SS arc, etc.)
    4. Gillian arrancar, normal captain-level shinigami, weak vizards. (Edorado, Renji, Hitsugaya, Kenpachi, Komamura, Ichigo pre-bankai, etc.)
    5. Lieutenant-level shinigami , natural adjuchas. (Renji pre-bankai, etc.)
    6. Seated-level shinigami, natural gillian. (Rukia)
    7. Everyone else sucks.

    Bear in mind that these are rough estimations, and that within the classes there is a lot of variation. For instance, Kenpachi is quite a bit stronger than Komamura. However, these are the rough power levels that we have seen in the series. When two characters that are in the same class have met, it's been a real fight. When there's been a gap of one or more classes between characters, the battle has generally been a decisive one, usually a one-hit kill. (Rukia's two victories have of course been glaring exceptions to this, but they were basically wins by plot.)

    Also, I left Chad and Ishida out of the lists because they're a pain to estimate. Ishida because his powers have fluctuated constantly, Chad because he has usually lost.

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  8. #18
    Ocram10 is offline Junior Member Newbie
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    I think that Yamato is by far the strongest captain, then Unohana and Ukitake next, then Byakuya, then the 4th captain squad leader. I don't think Kenpachi is that strong as Ichigo beat him with shikai.

    I was also wondering how strong Gin and Tousen are? Gin is supposed to be really strong, while Tousen cut Grimjaw's arm off but was beaten by Kenpachi.

  9. #19
    erachima is offline Senior Member Always Around
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    Ocram: You just said Byakuya was stronger than Aizen.

    Yamamato, Ukitake, Koryaku, and Aizen are all definitely stronger than Byakuya is. At absolute most, this makes Byakuya the 5th strongest captain. I'm inclined to believe he's the 7th though, since Gin and Unohana are both implied to be super strong. (Gin is the right hand man of the series's main villain, Aizen didn't just one-shot Unohana. If she weren't at least a strong Class 3 fighter there is no reason he couldn't have taken her out in half a second like he did Ichigo and the other captains he fought.)

    It's safe to assume that Tosen's increase in power since leaving SS means that he has become a vizard in the meantime. He certainly wasn't jobbing vs. Kenpachi so that's the only real explanation there is.
    Last edited by erachima; 04-29-2007 at 10:45 PM.

    Uryuu freaky, pale and geeky,
    how do your powers grow?
    "With gloves and scars and silver stars
    and swords that I shoot from a bow,
    yes, swords that I shoot from a bow."

  10. #20
    mr_zoot is offline Senior Member Well Known
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    I think the power is a question of age. Presumably the hollows used to create the current espada were very old. Half the captains are freakin ancient and Aizen is probably way older than he appears. At the point Uliquorra and Yammi retreat when confronted by Yoroichi and Urahara, the power match ups are still up for grabs.

 

 
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